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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Ok, so with sage advice found in this forum, I was able to figure out my transmission issue- Shift pattern was opposite of what I thought (thanks Search and Destroy). I've started it several times to find out I really should turn the fuel on first. With many archive inquiries in this forum, as well as several others, I've figured out the right plug, wire and gap to run with my magneto. The next thing left is a fool-proof kick method. It kicks back something fierce but not always. When it actually fires up, it's a smooth low kick that does it. Are the kick backs from me not timing the kick correctly? How do I know where TDC compression stroke on front cylinder is (if front or back matters)? Should I be 30+ degrees before TDC when I start the kick? Back of my knee was more than a little inflamed from the last leg wrestling match. I would like to end up with a legit 2-3 kick Pan/Shovel. Oh yeah, carb is a Super B w/superbowl, I don't believe mag has manual retard- likely a Hunt. Just put the non-resistor plugs in (J12yC Champions, I know most go with Autolite 75's or other preference) these are new and gapped at .019- tomorrow morning I'll do battle with it again...still have not ridden bike under its' own power :(
 

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Every bike has its own personality. But you can alter the personality, with a little help. Not a fan of S and S carbs, but that is my personal thought. I would make the mag retardable, which will make cranking much easier. If not, retard the timing a few degrees, and that will stop most kickbacks. Timing the kick, is a feel thing. Push the kicker through, until it gains compression and stops your light step. Squirt some fuel, or not. If you do, with the mag grounded, kick it through a few times to prime the cylinders. Then go back to your light step, until it is again on compression stroke. Unground mag, and kick. It is really not something that we can tell you, as we don't feel or see the results. But with a little attention, you can come up with a agreeable starting procedure. It may be different hot, or not. Good points, condenser and plugs wires, are very important, so don't cheap out there.
 

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everything i had ever seen for a Hunt magneto had said .015, but my knuckle was hard to start (read that as "really freakin' hard to start") and just for lack of any other ideas, i regapped the plugs to .025 and it fired off first kick. now, my engine is far from stock so maybe that made the difference, but you might try it just to see what effect it has.

-dan
 

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Good info here. First rule is: Make sure there are no good looking chics around. I've found the ease in which my bike starts is in direct proportion to the # of good looking women in the vicinity.
 

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I approach every kick bike the same way. 3 big full squirts of gas, find compression, crack the throttle slightly and stomp on the kicker with all my might.

Oh, and as far as the good looking chick thing goes, just remember before you kick that odds are she won't be going home with you and it'll fire right up.
 

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everything i had ever seen for a Hunt magneto had said .015, but my knuckle was hard to start
This is a good point.
Obviously people want to try to set things up by the book in terms of plug & point gap, as well as ignition timing.
But if after experimenting the bike still won't behave, don't be afraid to change parameters (one at a time, of course).

A while back I was stuck on the "timing line dead center in the window" thing...
once I learned to vary timing somewhat as well as plug gap, kickstarting life became much better.
 

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I'd play with the timming first and see whats happening if it's not firing (cough, fires but doesn't run, kickback, smoke outa carb etc...) and then you can adjust the timming depending on what symptom you have.

I run my mags locked down in a fixed position. Once you find that sweet spot, she'll fire hot or cold and without kickback. When hot, I can just stand on my kicker (as long as know one is watching) and my shovel will fire right up with that one easy stroke.

Sixball
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
F!
Yeah after 30 kicks- some hard, some kinda half-hearted and maybe even kind (they call it "finesse"- over rated). It started- damn it's shockingly loud without baffles- that may be part of the problem- hmmm. But I think the float needle is sticking as it ran out of fuel just as I was setting the idle mixture. Had I got it to lope right, I'd have been able to slide it out of the garage and down the street for a ride. It sure sounds potent when running, so much so that I'm actually intimidated by it and that has never happened with any machine I've owned> I have to get the better of this dragon or I'm gonna call into question my stones. Maybe a trip to the local wasted spark guru, Tar at Dead On Cycles is warranted. I just don't want to bring it down there if it aint under its own power- it obviously has plenty of it. Six Ball, How do you time your mags?? This bike does cough and smoke out the super b and kick back like a big, pissed mule. Then it kicks through smooth-like and starts- but not very often!
 

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I have two Pans and both have their own personalities. Anyways, don't get frustrated at first and even after you get it running it will take time to understand what the combination is. My 49, in the summer has been firing right up but now that the weather has cooled of to less than a hundred here in Vegas she is now wanting some more fuel to fire up. I did not think that just a few degrees would now warrant some prime but they are finicky and when I thought I figured out the combination she will fuck with me again and let me know just who the boss is! Bitchez.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I've friggin' gimped myself! my knee is not so stable. Then again, I've had three surgeries on it- what the hell do I expect?! I would really dig the easy way and have electric start option. That'd probably cost a shitload. I'm not throwing in the towel just yet, gonna try timing and check pushrod adjustment per this thread's advice and find out why fuel flow is stopping. Could be the Pingle- though I cleaned the screen and tank right off the bat. The way I figure, if bikes started by kick only for years before starters were an option, it must've worked for millions of people- and many Vets with worse knees than I could imagine. Back to the tech archives I go...
 

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Another thing to check when fuel stops flowing is the tank vent for a clog. Some have vented caps, some have a vent tube. When it dies open the cap. If you hear a whoosh, you got a clog.

It's easy to flood yer motor without half trying. After a couple squirts, keep yer hand off the throttle. If ya do flood it, kick it through several times with the throttle held wide open and the iggy off.

After finding compression don't let the kicker come all the way to the top. Try starting yer kick at the nine o'clock position and kick it like it owes ya money. Kick all the way though and the kicker will disengage at the bottom of the stroke. If yer getting kickback, usually it's because yer timing is too advanced. Have you at least static timed yer bike?

Once you get yer motor properly tuned and the kicking routine figures out, you will love yer motorsickle. Don't give up...
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
"Have you at least static timed yer bike?

Once you get yer motor properly tuned and the kicking routine figures out, you will love yer motorsickle. Don't give up...[/QUOTE]

I haven't static timed it yet but I do know it's a Morris mm74e mag. It has a tab welded to the shaft that is bolted to the case so mag is solid mounted- not able to manually retard for start. Even the retard screw/spring has been removed.
I'm trying to upload a pic of my magneto on lock-down. Is this a common mod for manual retard/auto advance Morris mags? What is the purpose?
 

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Good info here. First rule is: Make sure there are no good looking chics around. I've found the ease in which my bike starts is in direct proportion to the # of good looking women in the vicinity.
That's some good sound advice right there :D

This thread is gonna come in handy when I finally stop being a sissy and get my first "Kick Only" scooter.

Solo
 

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I'm old now, but someone who was old when I was comming up taught me that after 5 or 6 (or 10) kicks, it helps to knock on the gas cap three times and kiss the handlebars. Seemed to work.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
after 5 or 6 (or 10) kicks, it helps to knock on the gas cap three times and kiss the handlebars. Seemed to work.
HA! That's ridiculous- which won't stop me from giving it a whirl. It it works and I cling to the ritual like Bull Durham, it's gonna be awkward when the disproportionate number of hot chicks point and laugh when I start it up in public. It's a black art I tell ya!
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Oh so I figured out that the tab is supposed to be there to hold the damn mag in the case- Doh! I loosened the nut that holds mag body from rotating and turned it about 12 degrees or so clockwise which must be retarding the spark timing. I cleaned up the plugs (now gapped at .023) and let the cylinders air out, replaced plugs, gave the superbowl equipped super B a couple twists after pulling up the enrichener... Nothing but knee! It wouldn't even pretend to start- at least I didn't get the violent kick backs this time but no boom booms in the combustion rooms either. I think I'll figure out how to static time it and see if I have an intake leak. This thing has run and it sounds healthy when it does so things can't be that far off... or can they? Will keep posting and hopefully my pain in the knee will point some poor soul in the right direction in the future.
 
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