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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
It just came to my attention recently through one of our threads, the I'm sure now infamous $350 Ironhead post, that there are some people in our wonderful world of motorcycles, who would just like to lie, cheat, and steal from fellow brothers of speed. What I am proposing is that we create a sticky, web page, some sort of internet thingy, that is a list. It will be a list for people like rider728 who doing a normal good trade was sadly burned by a scumbag. Basically this list will be a place where we can all post the names, e-mails, phone numbers, even addresses if the poster chooses, of scammers and con artists like the one here. You are the one that chooses the amount of info you want to give on the person.

Also, in your posting, you should include any info you can about the transaction that you had. If there are messages back and forth on the forum, or in e-mail, that you can copy and paste perfect! If you have receipts or images of what he sent, and what you sent, perfect! You will even have a chance to write a little about what happened. That way you can tell others what the person sounds like, what his writing style is, what his "story" was (because there is always a story...). Today, on both the JJ and CC, I saw the true brotherhood that comes out of these forums, it is uplifting!

I think now we need to step things up and begin letting others know about these people, and the awful things they do, so all others can avoid having it happen in the future! There needs to be a place where we can burn these motherfuckers. They do NOT deserve any compassion or sympathy. If you agree with this, respond to my posting, and we can all together figure out something we can make that will stop these assholes. Maybe even the fact that they know something like this would exist will deter at least one person from getting burned...
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
We could make it like a Club. Start it with a few people who are well known in the biker community and then if you would like to submit, you'd have to get a member profile, and have another member vouch for you. Or you could submit a history of previous transactions you have done and moderators who themselves are well known could decide whether that person is legitimate or not. I think it is too negative to think that way. There are actions that could be taken to prevent it from being utilized by people who have any other intention then just helping fellow bikers from being scammed.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Plus, if you really start to think about, these kinds of cons are a big fucking deal in our community. Some people, most I should say, don't ever get their engines back. And others lose a good chunk of change, or are given something that is far below the quality stated. This is something that needs to happen, no one but the cops are doing anything about it, isn't it time we took this into our own capable hands? Every biker I know would rather deal with something themselves then have to call in the police...
 

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While I feel for the guy with the shovel engine in the other thread, a little common sense would have helped to avoid the situation. Don't ship your engine across the country to someone you've never met on their word in a few emails.

Your idea would eventually become a pissing match I fear as '59 pointed out.

Just use your head and protect yourself and you'll generally end up not getting sodomized by some scumbag that's out to done you. Some turd can put your name on that proposed list and then what recourse will youhave to clear your name? None.

People offer way too much of their personal info on the web, what with all this Facebook, Twitter and Myspace bullshit, it's a wonder everyone isn't being robbed blind. Don't show everyone on the street what's in your wallet and you generally won't get robbed for it.

Then again, I could be wrong.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Hmmm, I do agree with everything you said kickstart, but I feel that there would be a lot more to this list then just meets the eye. As you said, if someones name, such as your own, were to be placed on the list for some unfortunate reason, what then? Well first off, there would be things to prevent this. Also, anyone who is a legitimate dealer of things would not have this happen, even if someone was attempting to do it maliciously. A simple check would prove that they are in fact reputable. This "list" I speak off, is more just a forum, or blog, or whatever, where we bikers can discuss these types of things. Plain and simple. It would basically be a place where you could go to when you get burned, and tell people, and either get a huge amount of support like rider728, or find out about who it was that burned you.

Who wouldn't like a board they could check before doing business to see if the buyer/seller is on it and not regarded kindly? Also, yes, a few simple things could have been done to prevent rider728 situation, but some of these people are muuuch more crafty and smart about their frauds. I think people just tend to be a little trusting normally as well. Especially on such highly specific boards such as these, we like to assume every member is a stand up dude, I mean, how could you not be when you share my passion? But the scum of the earth finds every niche and hobby to exploit for their own purposes.

I am just saying. Wouldn't it be better to have and not need? Or really wished you'd had, but sadly, no luck.
 

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Sounds good on paper, but a little investigation into who you are shipping to, is usually good enough. Remember, most of us on here are legitimate and try to do the right thing. But the jerks who do the ripoffs, are not so truthful. Shipping a motor, to someone you don't know, before getting the cash, or trade parts, is part of the chance you take doing deals across the country. You can be ripped off, locally, just as easy. Not to mention, what do you do, when you sell a motor, and the buyer decides that you ripped him off, when you were as honest as you could be, in selling it. Then YOU are the one who is the recipient of the trashing of your name. Who would be the judge? Me? Or YOU? The best way to not get ripped off, is NOT to buy, or sell to anyone on here. Do it locally, when you can see what you are getting. Proceed with caution, and ask questions, and most of the time, you will come out with a smile on your face. Let the moderators do their job, by banning the culprits who use our honesty against us. Remember, the rules you make today, could be the rules used against us, by the jerks. If you don't believe that, then look more closely at the judicial system in this country.
 

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quoted for truth.

how about a list of reputable sellers and traders, that sounds a bit more constructive.
That would work better. But even that could get you ripped off. Trying to control computer based honesty, is like trying to control your bowels. Eventually, the rip offs, will figure a way to make theirselves look reputable. Then you are back to the starting point. Although, it would be better than listing all the rip offs. Remember, online honesty is only as good as the person who is telling you who and what he/she is. Reagan used this line, and it is true. Trust, but verify. If you don't feel like they are honest, don't do the deal. Better NOT to do the deal, than get ripped off. I also feel that almost everyone on here is honest. But it only takes ONE, to make us all uncomfortable. I have been lucky, with all my deals on here, but I prefer to think of it as informative. The bigger the deal, the more informed you need to be. Ask the buyer to give you a list of who he has sold to on here, if you are wondering. If he fails to give you a list, ask why. If he has no list to give, because he/she are newbies, then you have to make your own decision. If they give you the list, write the people and ask how the deals went. If they all went through with flying colors, then you are more than likely to be safe. If any, ANY of them, tell you they got ripped off, ask more questions to see how the deal went. Buying on line is a crap shoot at best. Less so, on JJ. But with any group of people, including preachers, there is a percentage of them, that are bad. You can't make everyone honest, with a list of ripoffs. But then, that is just one opinion, from a truly honest buyer/seller.
 

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I'm a member of a pitbike site where there is a lot of selling/buying going on in the classifieds. They web master came up with a feedback page and next to you avitar was your feedback % score. The scammers get weeded out pretty quickly
 

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'night of the long knives'

good idea in principle but it would fail because the same douche canoes would use it for their own ends.
Nice use of a historical reference. Gold star! Probably right, like the others in the thread, but I like the idea of the feedback score. Of course, isn't Ryan the guy to talk to about it? I'm not so computer-saavy, so I don't know the logistics of adding such a thing, i.e. how much work it would be for the site owner. That's where I'd start.
 

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I'm a member of a pitbike site where there is a lot of selling/buying going on in the classifieds. They web master came up with a feedback page and next to you avitar was your feedback % score. The scammers get weeded out pretty quickly
Now, THAT is a good idea. That, lets the seller rate the buyer, and the buyer, rate the seller. Way less politics, and more informative, just by looking at the seller/buyers profile. Who is going to contact the mods? Anybody offering?
 

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I will go out on a limb and put words in the Mods' mouths.
This topic has been covered many, many times over the years and the bottom line from above, as I perceive it, is that JJ is not a commercial site, but a forum to exchange ideas, answer questions, help other bikers/bikees, show off your shit, with a peer-to-peer want ad section added as a sideline.
I have had stellar transactions, I have had OK deals, I sold some stuff that was placed immediately on ebay by the buyer (same user ID!). I have had bad deals that took months to settle.
The erstwhile Mr. shovithead hit it right on the head; know who you are dealing with. Look at previous posts, try to find out what the other person is about. A feedback rating is next to worthless. It is totally possible to "game" feedback ratings as per ebay. It sounds like a nightmare to police! Make believe it is like the olden days, before the 'net. Buy locally, or take the risk.
And there is totally too much 'net drama as it is. A bad post from a disgruntled buyer/seller doesn't cost a thing to do, but takes up just as much space on the board as a legit question, or answer, or whatever.
Just because it is a public forum, and free, doesn't mean that it is all things to all people. I mean, we all like dogs, or skateboards, or XS650 chops, and wouldn't it be great if this site were a combination of ebay, "How do I build a bobber?" info board, and bitch/gossip board, but those already exist elsewhere, and are kinda silly. My 2 cents FWIW, Bruno.
 

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Bruno Desmartass hit it right on the head. This is not ebay, this is a chopper forum with a classified section to help members locate parts, but that is not the major function of this site. People get fucked, and that's life. all you can do is try and be the most honest and upstanding citizen that you can be, and use some street smarts in your dealings. Policing the internet never works, using paypal is alittle security, and the small fee that they charge to protect your money is well worth it IMO. i'm sure this thread will be closed as soon as a mod sees it.
 

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^^^ Hit it on the head ckunsman89 !!! & thanks also Russ !!! It's my responsibility to investigate before i dive in blind!!!! I Usually check everything before i ,"send payment" . The internet is a wonderful tool !!! As is family in the right places(LEO's) But the Mods here do not replace good ol' common sense & a stupid Rating # does not give me piece of mind... Social media, family in law enforcment, a friend who is an insurance fraud investigator & a guy who does title work for me are my weapons of "ASS" destruction,,, & i have & will continue to offer any help i can... It sucks to have the cops take one of your babies because i didn't do my home work,,, I found out that Ignorance is no aliby !!!! Took me over a year & 3 thousand dollars to get back what i bought legaly, but had a gut feeling something was not kosher... It wasn't!!!! Got back everything but the left case, because i kept records & i was persistant !!!
No website, rating system, or any other,"system" will stop or even deterr scumbags from stealing what isn't there's... What will is ,"COMMON SENSE"!!!!! & BROTHERS STICKIN TOGETHER LIKE WE DID FOR PAT !!!!!!!!!
MY $.02
 
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