Jockey Journal Forum banner
1 - 20 of 24 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Ok guys a quick rundown, 56 Panhead pretty much stock internals, S&S B carb and an F'n morris magneto manually advanced and retarded. Problem is this, I have timed it twice just to check myself, checked points half a dozen times, had it out and spun it fairly slow with a drill and watched the plugs zap several times. Reinstall it back in bike and it may start in six kicks, go back out 10 min later and kick until I cant kick anymore and the damn thing wont fire a lick. WTF am I missing here?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
37 Posts
You could also try a Thunder Jet on the B. I have a '59 Pan/Shovel that was a nightmare to kick until I put the thunder Jet on. A Super B can really only be dialed in for low to midrange power, or mid to high range. Getting a good setup with a Super B and anything other than electric start is very difficcult.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
37 Posts
It helps in that the carb gets set up to start, then the T-Jet kicks in later. Without the T-Jet the bike gets starved for fuel at higher RPMs if it's set up to start with a mag or kick. Since the Super B doesn't have an accelerator pump,it is a bit of a one trick pony. It's an excellent performance carb but has it's limitations.
If you set the carb up the way that's recommended, it runs great at mid to high RPMs, but good luck trying to get it to start. Mine was a 3-5 kicker with a mag. Now that I went back to a distributor with auto advance, it's always been a one kicker. The T-Jet is the best thing you can do to a Super B.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
431 Posts
I think it arguable that a super "b" is excellent at anything other than old school class. They certainly don't make for an easy starting kick only mag fired bike. The "t" jet adds another (sorely needed) circuit, but still no acc. pump. That squirt at just the right time really helps starting. I'm not saying you CAN"T get a bike to start easily with a "B", just that it's way harder than an "E" or even a bendix would be. If you want a performance carb for a Pan, use a CV. They are all the good from an SU without any of the downsides.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
692 Posts
Had your exact problem....80" Panhead, Super B and Morris Mag....

Dont get me wrong, Im a HUGE fan of the Super B and mag combo...but after chasing my tail on a inconsistent no start condition I switched to the Super E.

I tested & tweaked everything from intake pressure test and re-test to timing and re-timing to swapping out the mag with another....same deal....inconsistent to no-start condition until the E went on.

In my case, what I found is that my motor simply needs the extra fuel from the accel pump for cold starts. With just the enrichener circuit from the B, it wasnt enough fuel to start the bike consistently, especially when cool or cold ambient temps. When its warm (above 50 degrees) it was 1-2 kicks with the B.

But since the switch to the E, its a pretty consistent 1-2 kick machine....with a few twists of the wick, pull the enrichener, find the skinny lobe of the breaker cam and kick the pedal...usually starts right up.

I know this may ridiculous, but the B was way easier to tune with no mid-range cough.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Hey guys thanks for all the replies.
First, my startup procedure is usually 3 kicks throttle wide open with mag grounded, pull choke up, flip switch and kick my a$$ off. I have a bud I think that has an E that he is not using at this time, Im gonna try to do a swap this weekend and mess with it for awhile, maybe the carb is the whole issue. Will be in touch, thanks again
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
692 Posts
Hey Hawg....do what the good Dr says...try kicking without touching the throttle. Adjust the idle speed screw until the throttle plate is just barely open.

B's dont want the throttle WFO for starting.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
163 Posts
I had to turn my throttle wide open to get the bike started until I got the carb adjusted. Now I give it three squirts of gas a couple of prime kicks, turn the switch an she usually fires in three or four kicks. Each bike is different though and has their own procedure for starting.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
56 Posts
Is the mag new? I had the same problem with the same setup (except i had a joe hunt), turned out to be a little play in the magnetoshaft that made it change the timing after it had been kicked over. I could manage to start it after the timing hade been set the first time, then after that it was impossible. That changed after i installed a new shaft in the magneto.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,181 Posts
Recently went to the darkside and put a mag on my pan.

I'm the type to check everything before even trying to start a bike that's been changed or is new to me. Still was a hassle.

Experimentation over the last month revealed that the bike does not like to idle at low speed until warmed up. Turning the idle SPEED screw up one turn before kicking made this a one-kick setup even when cold. I made a thumb screw up for mine a long time ago so it's easy to adjust once warm.

Also, as has been mentioned, idle MIX has a profound effect on ease of starting with B and E carbs.

I put a toggle switch on my bike to ground the mag so I can give it a couple priming kicks before going "live". Also helpful.

Just like math class. . . change one variable at a time and note results.

Jason
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
630 Posts
I know all the cool kids have magneto and a old S/S carb (I am still liking a L carb) best combo I have had to date is a 30$ swap meet cv carb and china auto advance distributer. I screwed up my leg awile back. I can start with my hand once it has been warmed up. I have been primin it and rolling down drive way to start when cold! I know I am such pussy but attest I am still riding a pan! I used have a super b with a super bowl wich is accelerator pump made it much better
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Ok guys, got to mess with the bike this weekend. First I want to thank you guys for the ideas, I feel it is for sure a carb issue. I took an empty spray bottle and filled with gas, open the throttle wide open and give five or six shots. kick it over about three times, pull the enrichener, hit the switch, and it will light in about three to four kicks. So I guess the question is now, do I put the B superbowl with the acc. pump or just pitch the B and put an E carb on it?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
296 Posts
Just out of curiosity, can you kick it through two or three times with the throttle just cracked, mag off THEN light the mag and kick throttle wide open? The B hasn't got an enrichener so you need to use vacuum to pull fuel out of the bowl (just like when running) for that starting charge. I think that you're not putting any fuel in the motor when you prime kick with the carb wide open. When you give the throttle one or a hundred twists when the bike is off, you're just opening and closing a butterfly, that's it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I dont mean I hold throttle wide open when doing primer kicks. I held it wide open and squirted gas in with the spray bottle just like an accelerator pump would do. I then close throttle, hit the switch, and kick and it will start within 4 kicks. So I assume the whole problem is, it is not sucking in enough gas when doing the prime kicks. I think it just needs the help of an accelerator pump to feed it fuel or im gonna kick my ass off about every time I start it.
 
1 - 20 of 24 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top