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Old 08-23-2020, 11:27 AM   #1
joe49
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Default Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

When I have been told by young riders whose parents weren't even born when AMF was in control how bad they sucked that gets me to ranting.
Makes me wonder how old the writer of their article was.

https://www.lowbrowcustoms.com/blogs...91759#comments

My comment on LOWBROWs ''A brief history of the Harley Davidson Evolution engine'' of July 2014. I know this is late in coming but that is my point to not let incorrect info out in the ether. I also agree that the AMF years also brought employee problems that also jeopardized HD. But putting AMF as the bad guy's and that the Buy Back in June of 1981 saved the company by inventing the EVO is bullshit. The NOVA project which came with bring EVO's and VROD's into production, began in 1976. Lowbrow needs to edit that article, and use do diligence this time, not rumor.

MY comment on LOWBROW's site.
You need to edit your story. First with out AMF the jap invasion into the heavy market in the latter part of the 1960's was a company ending time. With out Rodney Gott of AMF HD would likely have ceased to exist.

https://www.harley-davidson.com/us/e...f-buyback.html

https://nwhog.com/tag/rodney-c-gott-motorcycle-museum/

Also EVO was a product of NOVA project, during the AMF years. With Porsche and Jerry Branch as the big contributors.

https://ultimatemotorcycling.com/201...va-look-might/

AMF kept up HD making us lots of Shovels and Sportys to continue to enjoy.
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Old 08-23-2020, 01:39 PM   #2
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

Can o' worms, Joe. The century so far has been a fertile time for the propagation of misinformation, disinformation, unexamined certainties, and plain old silly shit in every context I can think of, definitely including motorcycle journalism. It just doesn't seem to occur to young moto writers to question the received wisdom spouted by senior ignoramuses and/or folks with an axe to grind. 'S nothing new (although I think there's less, or no, oversight of shit-talking dummies these days, and of course the means to spread information, bad or good, are near unimaginably greater than, say, circa 2000).

At least it's a satisfying perquisite of old age* that we get to bitch & moan about the witless shit the Young Folks are getting up to.

Good post, anyway. You've struck a narrowly focused blow against rampaging ignorance.


* Not to tar you with the old-age brush; I got no idea what your age is, although I'd guess that it's not 19. The gift of indignation comes early to some lucky guys.
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Old 08-23-2020, 06:37 PM   #3
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

its no different then the 60s gen were convinced the man was out to get them

you remember that term

the younger gen thinks they know it all - yea so did my gen - then you mature if you like it or not

when the correct amount of time goes by you wake up one day seeing and knowing it was all bull $hit

what does that make everything you thought you knew was the truth - fake news dude
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Old 08-23-2020, 09:09 PM   #4
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

Yep. AMF bought and paid for the Evo. So many people are quick to deride them, but AMF dragged Harley into the modern age. A few books have been written about this very thing. Never mind they saved them from a hostile Bangor Punta takeover and Rodney Gott actually loved motorcycles.

But honestly, who reads books any more? Books are stupid.
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Old 08-23-2020, 10:22 PM   #5
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

I loved bowling as a kid, and AMF made it happen.

I like Harleys too.

Much more skeered of green-horn ham-fisters fucking up an old bike than I am of disgruntled line workers 50 years ago.

I know nothing. It's easier that way.

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Old 08-23-2020, 10:38 PM   #6
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

Greenhorn Hamfisters = good name for a patch club.
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Old 08-23-2020, 10:41 PM   #7
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

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Originally Posted by JasonMcElroy View Post

Much more skeered of green-horn ham-fisters fucking up an old bike than I am of disgruntled line workers 50 years ago.

Jason
You hit the nail on the head Jason.

In the one link that Joe provided, it shows how the AMF introduced CNC. It is highly likely that increased production and improved quality.

How much control did the AMF have over HD during those years?
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Old 08-24-2020, 10:13 AM   #8
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

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Originally Posted by HD48FL View Post
You hit the nail on the head Jason.

In the one link that Joe provided, it shows how the AMF introduced CNC. It is highly likely that increased production and improved quality.

How much control did the AMF have over HD during those years?
Bill Davidson stayed on as president under the control of AMF reporting to it’s then current chairman and CEO Rodney C. Gott.

In 1971, Bill Davidson was made Harley-Davidson chairman, but reported that he had little power while under AMF’s control. It was noted that he was chairman of the Harley-Davidson board that never met. Conflicts with AMF’s strategy and chaotic market conditions led to Bill Davidson’s resignation in 1973.

It was a period of high CEO turnover at Harley-Davidson. During this time, AMF named John O’Brian and then Gus Davis as president, marking the first time someone other than a Davidson would sit in the company presidents chair. Other Harley and Davidson family members continued on at the company under AMF’s ownership. Bill Davidson’s son John was vice president of Sales, and then moved up to become president after Gus Davis. William J. Harley was engineering vice president until his death in 1971. His brother John Harley remained at the company until his death in 1976 as the last Harley at Harley-Davidson.

From: httphttps://nwhog.com/tag/rodney-c-g...rcycle-museum/
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Old 08-24-2020, 10:24 AM   #9
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

Found this in my wandering the ether. I'll look for more to verify this but it is interesting. The HD being a cash cow, makes me wonder about this post being valid. If it was indeed a cash cow why would they have gone with the buy out? Though the CEO Tom York of AMF strategy of moving out of Leisure and more into industrial may have been in play.
https://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=528735
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Old 08-24-2020, 06:34 PM   #10
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

While we're on this subject, it's pretty common knowledge the Evo big twin is the best powerplant Harley has ever produced right? May not be pretty but damn they're good motors!
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Old 08-24-2020, 08:11 PM   #11
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

I worked at a dealership from early 73 to 78. My boss had worked for private shops and dealers in the Minneapolis area for years, and knew a few people at the factory. His biggest complaints about the AMF buyout was increased production (to recoup their investment), and decreased quality control for a few years. The 72-73 models were nightmares, always in the shop for BS failures of almost everything. In 1974 they seemed to be getting a handle on it and things got much better from there on. The other big issue of that era, was almost everything we ordered from the factory was back ordered except jackets, shirts, and other promo type stuff.. It did get better. Sportsters were a particular quality issue. According to our factory rep, HD had ramped up production in 70 to cash in on the Bronson craze, and quality suffered for a while. The company that had made the heads had problems about that time and AMF went to UF(United Foundries) who made a lot of their aluminum parts such as XL/FX triple trees etc. and had them make the iron heads. we had one 73 sportster with a compression leak that turned out to be a big bubble in the head casting with a pinhole in the chamber and a pinhole on the out side between the fins. This type of thing was very common. On the plus side, AMF did save HD, and they corrected most of the early issues. Rumor had it that Honda was going to buy HD just to put them out of business. I have no idea if that was true. Bottom line is HD probably would not be here if AMF had not bought them. Despite the hassels, I'm glad they did.
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Old 08-25-2020, 10:23 AM   #12
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

Found this.
https://www.encyclopedia.com/books/p...y-davidson-inc
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Old 08-25-2020, 10:55 AM   #13
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

People forget that Vaughn Beals was Vice President of AMF until the buy out in 81. He made this statement in response to criticism of AMF by various motorcycle magazine editors, Phil Schilling in particular. ''AMF invested very heavily in Harley-Davidson, both in capacity expansion and in engineering,'' he said. ''The very simple directive was given in 1974, to increase engineering at the maximum possible rate. And they did.''.
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Old 08-25-2020, 11:49 AM   #14
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

and another.https://www.strategy-business.com/ar...2878?gko=dcfc8
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Old 08-25-2020, 11:53 AM   #15
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

https://www.google.com/search?q=%2F1...hrome&ie=UTF-8
JJ isn't accepting a link to the first search on this page. So to read it you will need to go to it from the search.
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Old 08-25-2020, 12:26 PM   #16
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

I tried importing the PDF file, but it's too large.

I tried linking the site address for the PDF, but it only shows the first page.

Just follow Joe's instructions above if you want to read it.
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Old 08-25-2020, 02:12 PM   #17
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Default

Good articles joe the one above the other one was interesting
Was regan a biker I know he was a cowboy?
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Old 08-25-2020, 04:40 PM   #18
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

you have to wonder if the original V4 running prototype of the Nova project ridden by Vaughn Beals,still exists,and wheter it's in the museum,or where it might be exactly?? Unfortunately,just another one that didn't come to fruition,just like the scaled down version of the V-rod motor that was supposed to go in to the tube frame Buell in the late 90's...THAT would have also been something...
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Old 08-25-2020, 09:04 PM   #19
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

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Good articles joe the one as nove the other one was interesting
Was regan a biker I know he was a cowboy?
That I don't know. But I have seen no evidence he road. He saved Harley so I'd say, he was a biker at heart.
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Old 08-25-2020, 09:08 PM   #20
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Default Re: Lets get the record straight, LOWBROW.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HD48FL View Post
I tried importing the PDF file, but it's too large.

I tried linking the site address for the PDF, but it only shows the first page.

Just follow Joe's instructions above if you want to read it.
Thanks for trying, I had no luck, but I'm not that savvy 'puterin.
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