First Post 1960 Triumph Find

[latte hardtail]

Hello Everyone.
First post, and looking for advice/answers.

I have been lurking on the Board here for over a year, and now have my first Triumph in my possession. I had a guy drop this off at my house a week ago for $550. The frame seems different, and I am looking to see if it is what it is titled as "1960 Triumph T120".

First off it has been sitting for about 10 years, the motor turns free, has a Lucas AB11 Ignition Amplifier (2 - 6 volt coils), dead battery.

Looking for advice on getting it to start.

-Is there a routine I should go through after sitting this long?
-Is the battery 12 or 6 volt (battery has no markings)?


Hopefully I do not sound to needy but also looking for......

-Is there a guide somewhere on shortening the fork (I have found some
info, but not sure if it pertains to this fork)?


Bracing to get slammed for asking too many questions, but any advice to get me started would be great.

Before and after shots as it sits now.

[Eurotrashed88]

that's the best $550.00 score EVER.

[hatch]

Man....you got taken. I'll bail ya out, but I can only pay 600. .......(whatta freakin SCORE!!!!!).....Get some shop manuals, parts manuals, and read read read....then tear into it.

[Eurotrashed88]

First clean fuel system, tank and carb, make sure the carb isn't warped if it's the stock amal. If it is, I use a brake hone to straighten them out. Change plugs. Change the oil, run it hot, change it again. It looks like a 12v system judging from that electronic ignition box you have mounted.

[RetroRob]

(In my best Rob Stewart voice) "Some guys have all the luck...."

[chassy55]

Yep, great find. I'm partial to the duplex frame models. Looks really low in the rear, and with those pipes lowering the front may be tough. But you'll sort it out. Keep us posted, and congrats.

[Rathead]

Awesome buy! I never get any deals like that. Some guy was gonna drop an "old" bike by my work, but it sounds like a puch moped.... I can only hope it's something this good.
Have fun with it!

[panhead_pete]

Great Score. Perhaps post a pic of the engine numbers - just to be sure...

Id look for another place for those passenger pegs too mate, look a tad dangerous where they are.

Congrats and welcome

PS Hit the "enter" button after posting each pic

[latte hardtail]

Here is what I got.

[chassy55]

So do frame numbers match the engine? Looks like a cast iron head, much more common than the hard to find twin carb alloy head, but also probably make a better rider. Then again, may just be the black paint throwing me. One carb or two?

[reverb]

...hello man, yes, for those numbers that s a 1960 engine.
I cannot see you in your pictures if have the splitted head for the 2 carbs.
You are very lucky, the pre units Bonnies are very valuable and cost a few thousands..at least outside the USA.

[vorhese]

I paid much for for this so I think you got a good deal. The motor along is worth almost twice that.

[tombat]

I'm sorry to see that you have a set of the dreaded 1960 experimental "black wrinkle" cases. It was thought that Triumph had destroyed all of them after they were recalled..... I probably shouldn't do this but I would be willing to give you $100.00 more than you paid for the bike just so that there are no more of those black wrinkle case models out on the road endangering motorcycle enthusiasts..... of course I'm just shitting you. Seriously nice buy, hope you have fun with it.
Tombat

[whittiger650]

Amazing No doubt, you did well. Looks like a single carb head and aluminum painted black. I could be wrong though. Definitely a 1960 engine and the duplex is a nice frame too.

[Chevota]

Wow, I paid more for a basket case 650. . . I'm way jealous right now. Great find.

[buddhistpunk77]

wow that is a find and at more than the right price!
http://bigdcycle.com/books.html for parts list or http://www.classicbike.biz/triumph/triumph.htm
think about getting the Wes White DVD's from Lowbrow or even better the pre unit build DVD by Hughie Hancox he tells you what tools you need and was in the factory back in the day. I would go for total rebuild on engine unless you are sure of its history.
http://www.lowbrowcustoms.com/index...._triumph_forks
good luck cherish this bike it's highly desirable and you would be lucky to find another at that price
Jerome

[latte hardtail]

Thanks for all the replies, and comments. I can't wait to dig more to my project. I will keep my progress posted here (I'm pretty slow). I am sure to need more advice.

What I can tell you is I have spark now, plan to go over the carb. Plan is to disassemble
it completely, inspect it for wear, and replace the gaskets. I noticed the throttle is sticky also. The bike came with a Lucas magneto too; think it needs a rebuild, but it sounds expensive. Any advice on Battery vs. No Battery. Trying to minmize parts for a super simple look.

[Big John 13]

Originally Posted by Eurotrashed88

First clean fuel system, tank and carb, make sure the carb isn't warped if it's the stock amal. If it is, I use a brake hone to straighten them out. Change plugs. Change the oil, run it hot, change it again. It looks like a 12v system judging from that electronic ignition box you have mounted.

Eurotrashed has it down, the only thing is kick it over plenty with the plugs out after you change the oil to make sure that dry motor is lubed and MAKE SURE that your oil pump is working. Check the points and look at the plug wires and if she's real hard starting find a hill and push start her. On the battery question, I prefer them and so does my right knee.

[latte hardtail]

Is it possble to tell what the approx stretch\drop I have with my bolt-on hardtail (if any)? I would like to get about a 4" stretch with a 2.5" drop. So my real question; this is a Pre-Unit Engine, but is the frame an authentic 1960? I have yet to find anyone with this particular frame on the Boards here. I can not find a frame nummber anywhere; the title has the Engine number for the VIN.
So if I were to replace the hardtail section would I get a Unit hardtail?

[supercrouton]

Originally Posted by latte hardtail

Is it possble to tell what the approx stretch\drop I have with my bolt-on hardtail (if any)? I would like to get about a 4" stretch with a 2.5" drop. So my real question; this is a Pre-Unit Engine, but is the frame an authentic 1960? I have yet to find anyone with this particular frame on the Boards here. I can not find a frame nummber anywhere; the title has the Engine number for the VIN.
So if I were to replace the hardtail section would I get a Unit hardtail?

Your front frame loop is indeed a '60-'62 Duplex frame. The reason you have not seen one like it here, is someone has removed the tube that originally ran from the rear of the backbone forward to the downtubes, then he welded in gussets around the neck to compensate. The gussets are also why you probably haven't seen a frame number, as it is in that general area, and are likely now covered with bondo or welding. Yes, you can use a "unit" rear section on a Duplex frame. At first glance, your rigid section looks like a 3" drop, 4" stretch. This is a pic of a Duplex front (with your missing tube in place) and a 6" stretch, 2.5" drop frame, and one of my finished bikes with a Duplex frame. Nice score, BTW
Cheers, Dan.

[chassy55]

I'm not sure they had that support tube in 1960. Looks like it still has the original rear tank mount. That's rare on a custom. Why replace the rear section? I think it fits the bike good.

[supercrouton]

A Duplex is a Duplex. There was only one version, from 1960-1962 and they all came with that support tube. The front frame loop of the above bike is a 1960 Duplex. You are right though about the rear section, it looks good to me too
Cheers, Dan.

[BikeVice]

The first 60's didn't have the lower support tube, but frames were breaking in service. Triumph added the support tube mid year.

Eric

[latte hardtail]

Thanks for all the quick insight.
All of the people here have a real passion for the art of Cycles. That is what I love about the Boards here. I have learned a lot from reading here over the last year, and can tell I have only scratched the surface.

Now to some more figuring. I did a little bit of mock up tonight after work, and took some quick measurements. I want the bottom frame rails to be as perpendicular to the ground as possible. So I took the front wheel off and blocked the bike up with some 2x4's. The bike sat about 3.5" off the ground. I love the low look, but what is the optimal ride height for lowness? I then shoved a 3/4" piece under the front, and it still looked decent. With the later scenario the approx. center of the fork front axle is 3" lower than the wheel axle. In your opinions how much fork travel do I need to lose. I know 3 is the obvious answer, but with sag and all in consideration I'm guessing maybe 2 - 2.5.

One last question for me to go on for now. Do I tear this engine down (turns free, and the previous owner said it ran when put away 10 years ago)?

Mock-up pics.

[supercrouton]

Originally Posted by BikeVice

The first 60's didn't have the lower support tube, but frames were breaking in service. Triumph added the support tube mid year.

Eric

I stand corrected, as usual

[tombat]

Originally Posted by latte hardtail

Thanks for all the quick insight.
All of the people here have a real passion for the art of Cycles. That is what I love about the Boards here. I have learned a lot from reading here over the last year, and can tell I have only scratched the surface.

Now to some more figuring. I did a little bit of mock up tonight after work, and took some quick measurements. I want the bottom frame rails to be as perpendicular to the ground as possible. So I took the front wheel off and blocked the bike up with some 2x4's. The bike sat about 3.5" off the ground. I love the low look, but what is the optimal ride height for lowness? I then shoved a 3/4" piece under the front, and it still looked decent. With the later scenario the approx. center of the fork front axle is 3" lower than the wheel axle. In your opinions how much fork travel do I need to lose. I know 3 is the obvious answer, but with sag and all in consideration I'm guessing maybe 2 - 2.5.

One last question for me to go on for now. Do I tear this engine down (turns free, and the previous owner said it ran when put away 10 years ago)?

Mock-up pics.

In my opinion stance is an often and quite glaringly overlooked component of an appealing bike. As can be seen in your mock up photos, you haven't spent a dime yet and just by getting the stance to an eye pleasing level it already looks quite different (better I would say). I think that a couple inches out of the forks would about right, you might test the drop by refitting the front wheel and having a sit. That should give you a good starting point for amount to lower the forks. There are some good tech threads here about lowering external spring triumph forks.
As far as the engine goes..... well that's your call but sludge traps are a significant concern for Triumph lower ends..... I'm sure you could run it a bit but it could be a time bomb, I am not aware of any way to really tell the condition of the sludge trap without splitting the cases and pulling it out. Then you always end up getting into the "while I'm down here...I really should....." situation, at least I usually do.
Tombat

[Englishman]

Originally Posted by BikeVice

The first 60's didn't have the lower support tube, but frames were breaking in service. Triumph added the support tube mid year.

Eric

I have a 61 with that tube missing, I haven't yet determined if it was just removed by a PO.