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Old 07-04-2018, 06:07 AM   #1
SlickSarg
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Default 98 EVO Softail Noise

Hi,
Well Iīm the owner a 98 EVO Softail, and recently I had the some noises in my engine.
It started with a faulty lifter. I replaced all four of them. Next I heard a noise, and it was the Front Exhaust Adjustable Pushrod that doesnīt have the clearance of the stock ones. So I bought and installed a set of 4 OEM pushrods, and the noise is gone.
But now, I have a different noise, and itīs bothering me. I used the mechanic stethoscope to try and identify the source of the noise. I canīt hear nothing in the lifters, oil pump, etc, however I can ear this noise.
Hereīs a link to a video I made of the engine. If you listen closely in the end of the video you identify the noise.

I also saw a video in youtube of a bike that seems to have the same problem.
https://youtu.be/ACkGt6_jqbs
Hope you guys can help.
Thanks
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Old 07-04-2018, 08:02 AM   #2
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

Did you ever change the cam bearing? How much mileage?
Problem is the part number for the cam bearing never changed but the supplier did. You should look for the koyo 138b.
The lifters from Harley are fantastic, they are the B lifters too. I think unless you're into high hp & torque numbers you don't needs JIM'S or any other aftermarket brands. Which lifters did you buy?
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Old 07-04-2018, 08:43 AM   #3
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

Sounds like a tap, and the two places you have not looked, is the cam endplay, and the rocker endplay in the heads. Evos can be shimmed on the rockers and the cam, and with a lot of miles(being a 98, I am assuming here) they probably need some attention. I would go more to the rockers, as they are known to wear the ends of the rockers and the carriage flanges over time. And both tap when they need attention. And what is the oil pressure like? When the pumps get worn, they lose idle pressure, and that can make the lifters seem weak at idle.
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Old 07-04-2018, 09:13 AM   #4
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

The noise is consistent with valvetrain. I also hear some knocking, but its hard to make out and its a video.... could be a train five miles away.

My first thought was oil pressure as well. And Id want to open the filter... just for a starting point.
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Old 07-04-2018, 10:09 AM   #5
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

When was the last time you cleaned out your tappet screen?
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Old 07-04-2018, 11:17 AM   #6
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

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Quote:
Originally Posted by shovithead View Post
Sounds like a tap, and the two places you have not looked, is the cam endplay, and the rocker endplay in the heads. Evos can be shimmed on the rockers and the cam, and with a lot of miles(being a 98, I am assuming here) they probably need some attention. I would go more to the rockers, as they are known to wear the ends of the rockers and the carriage flanges over time. And both tap when they need attention. And what is the oil pressure like? When the pumps get worn, they lose idle pressure, and that can make the lifters seem weak at idle.
Hello guys
Thanks for all the input. Trying to respond to everyone:
@tomsoftail I didnīt mentioned, but I changed the Cam bearing. I bought standard lifters.
The bike has 30K plus miles.
@shovithead I posted a couple of photos of the cam, and the rockers.So you say that the cam can be worn out. The oil pressure is good and steady.
@JAWS Noise is consistant, itīs normal?
@govmule84 at the same time I replaced the cam bearing
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Old 07-04-2018, 11:49 AM   #7
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

Sounds like idle is to low.
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Old 07-04-2018, 01:26 PM   #8
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

Hi
Iīve made a video while the engine is hot, and the noise is louder.


I used a mechanic stethoscope and I think I can pin point the noise to the bottom of the engine, on the flywheel area.

Last edited by SlickSarg; 07-04-2018 at 03:16 PM.
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Old 07-04-2018, 03:13 PM   #9
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

I mean, it sounds like from the video that the tapping sound is in time with valve train movements. Could be valve adjustment....which would be consistent with hot engine as the clearances increase.

The knocking is what I am wondering about. I may be hearing things. The video link doesn't work.FYI
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Old 07-05-2018, 06:29 AM   #10
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

Hi JAWS, the link is now good. The knocking is giving me the creeps.....Iīm starting to think that is definitely something in the fly wheel.
The link to the you tube video, the owner said: "New crank pin solved the noise.".
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Old 07-05-2018, 07:00 AM   #11
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

First thing, is you have to realize that sounds can be in the bottom and sound like they are in the top. You say you used a stethoscope and it sounds like it is in the bottom area. So, that could be a worn our crankshaft/bearing. One thing you can do, short of tearing the top end off, is pull your outer primary cover, and check the end play and tightness of the sprocket shaft nut. If the nut is loose, the timkens can be not tight enough to keep them synched against the races.

When you put the new lifters in, did you make sure you put the flats in the right direction? If not they will not oil correctly. And if you installed them and turned the motor, before they had time to "equalize" the oil in them, and spun the motor, you could have bent a pushrod, or a valve, if you ran it to soon.

Other than that, if all is well there, then you would have to inspect the crank rod bearings, and the sprocket shaft timkens and pinion bearing. The rods may be the problem and that is a special tool nightmare, unless you have a well set up shop. But any decent mechanic can check the endplay, shaft bearings and up and down movement in the rod bearings. The quick fix would be a new crank assembly, but that is rather expensive, over fixing the one in there.

Videos are great to show you riding, but suck to hear sounds. Even when they are in the shop and you can move to the different area to listen, it is still hard to locate. You already know this. But the stethoscope is the easiest, and the torn down motor is the final way to determine the location of a knock.
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Old 07-05-2018, 08:09 AM   #12
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

You know what you need to do.... If it was mine, and having someone mention “new crank pin” and I didn't install it, for me would raise a whole new set of questions.
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Old 07-05-2018, 08:16 AM   #13
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

Thanks JAWS and shovithead for the replyīs.
First Iīm trying to check what shovithead mentioned: "is pull your outer primary cover, and check the end play and tightness of the sprocket shaft nut. If the nut is loose, the timkens can be not tight enough to keep them synched against the races. "
Maybe can be the problem, if not.....looks like a full tear down of the engine is in order.
Can I replace only the crankshaft pin and still maintain all the other components?
Thanks guys
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Old 07-05-2018, 11:54 AM   #14
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

My opinion, would be to replace the crank pin and rod bearings, but that may require honing the races and over size rollers, or even replacing the races and stock size rollers. But you have to have the hone to do that. It is not a bolt in set. You could buy a new rod set with bearings and crank pin, that would be a bolt in set, as long as you know how to install it, have the tools to hold the wheels square, and torque to spec, then true the wheels. And that is not really a novice procedure, and requires some special tools, like a truing stand and a way to get full torque on the nuts. The only bolt in way you could possibly do, is a complete crank assembly, and they are around 1000 dollars US, not sure how much it would cost you. Even then, it would still need the new Timken set, and a way to press the first Timken on the sprocket shaft, then the second one, after in the LH case. Seems that the shafts on the 98 are part of the wheels, which makes truing some what easier, but still would need a truing stand, or a good solid lathe and some way to mount it, and set up dial indicators to get it straight. With a Service manual, and some coaching on here, some special tooling, you may be able to do it. But it is not for the novice mechanic, unless you want to learn, and maybe do it more than once. That, could be expensive, if you get it wrong.
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Old 07-05-2018, 04:27 PM   #15
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

Does it have a compensator sprocket nut? I don't recall what primary drive you said it had and I'm too lazy to go read a few posts back....
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Old 07-05-2018, 08:58 PM   #16
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

What cam is it?
My Wood w6 is noisy and I went and tightened the Rivera adjustable pushrods a thousandth more and it quieted it down a lot.
If it is a stock N grind then disregard.
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Old 12-18-2018, 06:45 PM   #17
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Hello guys
Sorry for the long long time to reply, but life is keeping me pretty busy. Meanwhile I've disassemble the front cylinder and I noticed that the connection rods have a huge range of motion, when they should be pretty much "fixed". I probably not explaining correctly but the connection feels "loose".
Next step, disassemble the all engine and see what the hell happened. Someone pointed to the crank pin, and probably they're right. I'll keep you guys posted as soon as I know more.
Thanks
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Old 12-18-2018, 11:32 PM   #18
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

Loose up and down or loose side to side?
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Old 12-19-2018, 03:53 AM   #19
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

Hey govmule84, side to side and up and down.
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Old 12-19-2018, 04:11 AM   #20
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Default Re: 98 EVO Softail Noise

Quote:
Originally Posted by SlickSarg View Post
Hey govmule84, side to side and up and down.


There you go. Bummer.
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