Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i. - The Jockey Journal Board

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Old 05-20-2010, 11:36 AM   #1
supercrouton
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Default Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

So, I want to know who of you here ride unit Triumphs with no battery AND electronic ignition. I have searched it, and know it can be done, but I would like to hear only from the members that own/ride them, what you are currently running, and what you would have done differently, if anything.

Thanks in advance, Dan.
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Old 05-20-2010, 11:40 AM   #2
Dan Boy
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

Hey Dan, I am using no battery with electronic ignition, it was easy to setup, like half an hour from no wiring at all to having the bike running. Starts first, second kick, I have absolutely no problems with it thus far.

I am running the Boyer transistor box, digital twin coil, powerbox and stator plate and rotor.

I hope that answers your question some.

Cheers Dan.
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Old 05-20-2010, 12:18 PM   #3
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Boy View Post
Hey Dan, I am using no battery with electronic ignition, it was easy to setup, like half an hour from no wiring at all to having the bike running. Starts first, second kick, I have absolutely no problems with it thus far.

I am running the Boyer transistor box, digital twin coil, powerbox and stator plate and rotor.

I hope that answers your question some.

Cheers Dan.
Dan,
Thanks for your reply. When you say "powerbox" is this the rectifier for the stator? if so, what brand is it, Tympanium? (pic mabey)? Does it have a capacitor built-in?
Thanks, Dan.
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Old 05-20-2010, 12:28 PM   #4
Dan Boy
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

Dan, Firstly I am a whole lot better at a lot of things besides electrics so if I am not answering your question fully enough, please come back at me for more info.

The PowerBox (Boyer) is the capacitor unit it has two wires in and two out. It takes the two feed wires from the alternator and puts out 12 volts via the output red and black wires. Its sole purpose seems to be putting out 12 volts only so I guess it must have its own regulator in there as well.

I'll dig out the wiring diagram and scan it as that might help you out some.

Cheers Dan.
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Old 05-20-2010, 12:37 PM   #5
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Boy View Post
Dan, Firstly I am a whole lot better at a lot of things besides electrics so if I am not answering your question fully enough, please come back at me for more info.

The PowerBox (Boyer) is the capacitor unit it has two wires in and two out. It takes the two feed wires from the alternator and puts out 12 volts via the output red and black wires. Its sole purpose seems to be putting out 12 volts only so I guess it must have its own regulator in there as well.

I'll dig out the wiring diagram and scan it as that might help you out some.

Cheers Dan.
Yes, that is very helpful Dan, I googled boyer powerbox and the associated directions came up. They even indicated that when the battery was low: "one should start the bike without the battery connected, then reconnect it after the bike was running to charge it".

I wonder if the Tympanium unit works the same way as the Boyer Power Box? Or does it need an external capacitor? Hmmmmm......
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Old 05-20-2010, 12:58 PM   #6
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

I don't know the ins and outs of the PowerBox, I suspect Boyer keep that a bit of a secret.

Hope this helps:-



As you can see this shows a setup with a battery but I am not running one and it starts just fine.

BTW, that whole kit cost me a little over 200UKP and to go from having absolutely no electronics on the bike to a running bike in 30 minutes it was well worth it and it has to be more reliable and stable than the traditional route.

D
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Old 05-20-2010, 01:12 PM   #7
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

Thanks Dan!

Anybody else?
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Old 05-20-2010, 07:16 PM   #8
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

I do too, but I did not set it up so can't tell you much. My bike is running a Microtech ignition system. But just like Dan, my bike runs absolutely fine, and starts first or second kick.

I do have to wait a few minutes before switching my headlight on or the sudden power drain will kill the bike. Only issue I have is blowing tail light globes - it's not often enough to annoy me to do something about it, but I do keep 2 or 3 spares in the garage.
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Old 05-20-2010, 08:16 PM   #9
bruno desmartass
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

Hey. I installed a Sebring elect. ignition/battery eliminator on my 64 Bonnie and ran it for years. Prob 70's vintage. Don't hear about them much. Never a problem, but you had to keep on top of the tune. I have just rebuilt the bike with a hardtail and I'm re-installing the unit. It's a small "black box" deal with heat sinks, maybe 3" square that runs off an ignition trigger mounted on the alternator (as I recall) and has outputs that feed coil and lighting circuit. Good luck. Bruno
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Old 05-20-2010, 08:39 PM   #10
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

crouton, I've been running a unit Triumph without a battery for over 20 years. I run a podtronics rectifier/regulator,a Pacifico battery eliminator(basically a glorified capacitor), an a boyer analog EI.(black box) with a Accel dual lead coil(3.5 ohm primary resistance) with solid copper core plug wires. Jack
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Old 05-20-2010, 09:49 PM   #11
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

I've got three set up that way, but since they are unit BSAs I guess you don't wanna hear about em.
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Old 05-20-2010, 10:23 PM   #12
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

I am extremely interested in this thread, Sorry if I am intruding S.C. I have searched this site since I first logged on and never really found good info or any wiring diagrams for using a Boyer successfully with no battery. It would be awesome to actually see how one of these bikes are wired. I am in the process of trying set my bike up this way.

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Old 05-20-2010, 10:35 PM   #13
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

We do a lot of wiring at our shop we have done many E.I. bikes with no battery wiring, usually a couple per month, One of our favorite set ups is the "Boyer battery eliminator with light delay". it is a regulator/ rectifier with a capacitor and it has a cool feature that puts all of the power to the ignition and only after the system develops a surplus of at least 11 VDC does it turn on the light circuit. we normally use the Boyer ignitions with these but lately we have been using the Tri-spark ignitions because of they have the ability to correctly function as low as 8VDC. One of the down side to the Boyer ignitions is they will go into full advance at low voltage and will kick back on start up. The down side to the Tri-spark is they cost $300.
Also some other helpfull hints are wire the bike a negitive ground and use an LED tail light and license plate light to put a lower demand on the charging system at idle and less flickering.
another good product is the Sparx charge unit with capacitor for about $70 we use this with the Tri-sparx ignition and it balances out the cost well because the Boyer light delay costs about $150.
The Boyer ignition and Boyer light delay charge unit will set you back about $300.
The Sparx charge unit with cap. and a Tri-spark ignition will cost you about $370.
Both are good systems.
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Old 05-20-2010, 11:06 PM   #14
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

Thanks guys, that info is very helpful.
Cheers, Dan.
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Old 05-23-2010, 10:31 AM   #15
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

I run analogue boyer, 3 phase sparx alt/rect/reg, and 6 radio shack 4300uf caps wired in parallel, bike starts first kick 90% of the time
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Old 05-29-2010, 10:39 PM   #16
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

well I found a unit Triumph in the collection. Mark 3 Boyer, podtronics, and the blue cap. Starts easy and runs good for several years now:
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Old 09-08-2013, 01:45 PM   #17
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

Thank you for this information. I am currently building two Norton 750's. One I've owned for 20 years, one from the ground up. I'm throwing the stock wiring harness away, after 42 years its looking pretty ratty. I have been running a Boyer for 10 years and only had one problem which was easily fixed. I was looking for some advice on what is current and found it here. You just saved me a bunch of time and probably money. Thank you for taking the time and posting this information.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony the torch View Post
We do a lot of wiring at our shop we have done many E.I. bikes with no battery wiring, usually a couple per month, One of our favorite set ups is the "Boyer battery eliminator with light delay". it is a regulator/ rectifier with a capacitor and it has a cool feature that puts all of the power to the ignition and only after the system develops a surplus of at least 11 VDC does it turn on the light circuit. we normally use the Boyer ignitions with these but lately we have been using the Tri-spark ignitions because of they have the ability to correctly function as low as 8VDC. One of the down side to the Boyer ignitions is they will go into full advance at low voltage and will kick back on start up. The down side to the Tri-spark is they cost $300.
Also some other helpfull hints are wire the bike a negitive ground and use an LED tail light and license plate light to put a lower demand on the charging system at idle and less flickering.
another good product is the Sparx charge unit with capacitor for about $70 we use this with the Tri-sparx ignition and it balances out the cost well because the Boyer light delay costs about $150.
The Boyer ignition and Boyer light delay charge unit will set you back about $300.
The Sparx charge unit with cap. and a Tri-spark ignition will cost you about $370.
Both are good systems.
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Old 09-08-2013, 03:48 PM   #18
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Default Re: Role-call: unit trumps w/no battery AND e.i.

I did E.I conversion(t100s). read stuff from Torch and Crouton(thank you very much)
Boyer micro digital(Only because came with bike) bought a couple of capacitors
original alternator (1970) led tail light, switch on front headlamp(off when kicking)2 kicks, 3rd starts, easy kicks,headlamp on no go(is like your putting juice into capacitors then bang it works)
I converted my ULH to EI 8 years ago and is sweet also done a few 60s porsches and is impressive the engine running difference.
If I'm doing again will go pazon, sparks capacitor/regulator, led tail, headlamp off switch.(only because i contacted boyer and was vague answering my questions,but also emailed pazon and no answer yet 5 months ago)
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