47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project - The Jockey Journal Board

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Old 11-19-2016, 08:12 PM   #1
blown36
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Default 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

I'm looking at a project available locally and searching for some info.
Its a 74" FL matching cases knuckle with S&S wheels, wiseco pistons and recoed heads. The engine was a strong runner that the owner pulled out and replaced with 86"panhead to do some drag racing. Its now sitting in a raked 57 straightleg frame with a 4 speed ratchet lid trans. The front end is extended FL hydraulic.
I've searched on here and google for frame dimensions/drawings with no good results.
I think if I can get my hands on it I will replace the neck and run a springer front end in it.
So does anyone have some tips on where to find frame drawings that are correct and readable?
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Old 11-19-2016, 08:40 PM   #2
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

http://www.shovelhead.us/pics/sheets/1948-frame.pdf

Best ones I have come across.
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Old 11-19-2016, 10:21 PM   #3
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

Thankyou, very helpful.
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Old 11-20-2016, 01:18 AM   #4
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

There are some options. If the neck is only raked to 33,34 degrees you could run an XA style Harley springer which is 2-3/8" longer than stock. That was a very common modification in the early sixties.
If the neck is raked to 36,37 degrees you could use a set of 3 degree raked bearing cups and install them backwards.
Stock rake on a Pan frame is 30 degrees.
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Old 11-20-2016, 01:28 AM   #5
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

Make it a long bike... just sayin.
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Old 11-20-2016, 03:19 AM   #6
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

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Old 11-20-2016, 07:47 AM   #7
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

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Make it a long bike... just sayin.
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Old 11-20-2016, 11:57 AM   #8
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

Hey Zeeman, where is this from? These schematics would look awesome in a studio or living room
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Old 11-20-2016, 12:07 PM   #9
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

I never measured the neck rake when I looked at it and because it was shoved in a corner never got a good side shot of it. You can kind of see the length of front fork in one shot, must be around 4 over and the frame was sitting close to level on flat tires.







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Old 11-20-2016, 03:01 PM   #10
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

Looks like pan jugs, any other mods done?
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Old 11-20-2016, 06:05 PM   #11
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

I hadn't noticed the pan cylinders till now, thanks.

I guess it was built with them a fair while ago before there was a quality aftermarket knuckle cylinder available?
It does have a performance camshaft possibly Leineweber 1S.
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Old 11-20-2016, 06:22 PM   #12
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

Frame looks to have been chopperised a bit, no sidecar loops or footboard tabs.. might be better off selling that one & getting a 1947 bullneck frame if you get it, depending on your plans. Are they asking a lot for the bike?
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Old 11-20-2016, 06:28 PM   #13
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

Original Harley wishbone frame schematic. I believe you can buy copies on Ebay, but some are pretty poor quality, hard to read all the measurements.

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Hey Zeeman, where is this from? These schematics would look awesome in a studio or living room
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Old 11-20-2016, 07:48 PM   #14
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

How many fingers between down legs and bottom of neck? Normal sized hand 10* per finger.... on old fella showed me once. Gives an idea, not terribly accurate. Stock neck I can just get three, mine at 40* I can get 4.

That seat post mold job indicates maybe more molding and a decent job from what I can see of the frame. Side car loops and all shaved...
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Old 11-20-2016, 08:34 PM   #15
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

I'll have to go and have another look, pump the tires up and wheel it out of his shed.
It certainly has been chopperised.

In Oz, we have to stick to the "550 rule", i.e. 550 mm from the vertical line drawn thru the top centre of the neck and a vertical line drawn though the front axle centreline. 21.6 inches. So thats as big as we can go and get it registered as a long bike.

I did some quick drawings and numbers in CAD and allowing 3 inch offset to the axle with a springer 36 degrees is probably max rake. I think this frame might be closer to 40 degrees.

I would have to work with it or buy a repro frame which would be expensive with our dollar at 3/4 of the greenback.

The owner wants AUD 15k for it.
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Old 11-20-2016, 08:47 PM   #16
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

15K isn't a bad price, although the value looks to be mostly in the motor.. 47 knuck motors are almost bringing that by themselves at the moment. As long as the work done to the motor was done by someone knowledgeable.

You can get under 550 with a 40 degree rake. I have a 1957 frame with 45 degree rake and 6 over springer, just under 550.
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:05 PM   #17
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

It dosn't look like it is over 550
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:21 PM   #18
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

When I drew it up I was trying to keep the trail between 3 and 4 inches. I can see that 40 degrees would work at the 550 rule if the trail was larger.

First chopper for me and unsure of what works, and I know what works comes before what looks good.

I'll message you and give you a ring if you'll send me your number.

Cheers.
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Old 11-21-2016, 11:04 AM   #19
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

Quote:
Originally Posted by blown36 View Post
I'll have to go and have another look, pump the tires up and wheel it out of his shed.
It certainly has been chopperised.

In Oz, we have to stick to the "550 rule", i.e. 550 mm from the vertical line drawn thru the top centre of the neck and a vertical line drawn though the front axle centreline. 21.6 inches. So thats as big as we can go and get it registered as a long bike.

I did some quick drawings and numbers in CAD and allowing 3 inch offset to the axle with a springer 36 degrees is probably max rake. I think this frame might be closer to 40 degrees.

I would have to work with it or buy a repro frame which would be expensive with our dollar at 3/4 of the greenback.

The owner wants AUD 15k for it.

15K AUD?!! That's like 8 grand in sterling. Christ if you don't want it tell him I'll have the engine! .

Looks like it'll be a good bike. Frame looks like it's had a lot of work though. Never quite understood why people go ham on the tabs. my pan has an aftermarket jobby, makes life so difficult!
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Old 11-21-2016, 03:50 PM   #20
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Default Re: 47 Knucklehead, 57 Pan Frame Project

Yep, working on it.

Deal is sealed and done, should collect it next month.

Last edited by blown36; 11-22-2016 at 12:05 AM.
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