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Old 05-30-2012, 04:39 PM   #1
Ratrodder23
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Default Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

So I bought my first vintage Triumph about a year ago, I really liked it when I bought it but I feel like changing it around and making it my own.

Heres what it started out as.



Anyway Ive got about everything I need to get started but Im in need of a little help. Im going to use a conical front and rear hub. My first question is about bearings for both. Ive seen some as cheap as 10 a pair or some at 15-20 a side. What would be my best bet here, are they all the same or are others better then others, any suggestions?

The rear hub I have was taken apart when I got so it has no bearings, there are spacers or dust guards though. When using new sealed bearings, are these spacers required, if so does someone have a diagram or picture of the hub? Also if I need them, where can I get new spacers, the one I have is bent a little.

Once I get the new beaings for the rear ill be sending the hubs to get laced up at Buchanans. Im planning to use a 21 x 1.85 wheel up front, needs to be 40 spokes. Id like to use a dimpled wheel to match the rear wheel but Buchanans doesnt offer one. Does anyone know where I could get one at? Ill ive found in 21" dimpled wheels are either 36 spoke or 1.60s.

My other question is about the oil lines. Im planning on getting a custom oil tank built, Im also going to be running a remote filter. My question here is what size oil line would I want to be using for the remote filter. I need to order both still so I want to be sure I get the right size hose barbs for the remote and the tank.

Thanks for the help, just need to get these things taken care of then I can start a legit build thread.

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Old 05-30-2012, 07:39 PM   #2
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

...hello,
you always need the spacers, no matter if they are sealed.
In case you get rid of the dust covers, you ll need a larger spacer to compensate the distance.

-I think for a rigid is better to buy the best ones.

regarding lacing, you can buy a kit from Buchanan s and then lace. The info needed is here.

-you do not really need an external oil filter if you change the oil at fine intervals and clean the stuff right.
Putting more lines, in my opinion is for problems (if you ride in daily basis)

-also, I suggest to put the battery a bit higher.
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Old 05-30-2012, 09:00 PM   #3
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

IYF the rear axle is a different size on the conical. conicals are 5/8 and the one you have, that your axle plates are made for, is 3/4.

Are you looking to 21" in the front and rear? From experience I would suggest not to.
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Old 05-31-2012, 12:43 AM   #4
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

^ EVERYTHING he said.
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Old 05-31-2012, 06:15 AM   #5
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

That's a nice bike!! Don't change anything, mayby put that headlight a bit closer to the bike, or get it something like this: http://www.lowbrowcustoms.com/index...._detail&p=2231

Post it in the "Best Triumph Bobber Pic Thread"!
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Old 05-31-2012, 10:14 PM   #6
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

It's a nice runner but it's not as nice as the picture looks. It's spray bombed and it was mostly thrown together. It would look sweet all cleaned up but it would need a total make over. So I figure I'll change it up. Ill be doing a 21" front and 16" rear.

As far as the conical hub goes. I know it's 5/8. I got a new hardtail made by TFMW with 5/8 axle plates so im good to go there. I keep searching for bearings but all I find is made in china crap. Anyone know of some nice made in the states bearings??

For re assembling the hub, does anybody have a diagram of it. I did a search and found a thread from four years ago, someone posted a link to what sounds like what I need, but the link was expired.

Also anymore advice on lacing a wheel yourself? I've never tried, maybe Im wrong but I feel like the conical hubs would be the wrong place to start?

Thanks again
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Old 06-01-2012, 12:29 AM   #7
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

Have you contacted Classic cycles, Rabers, Map, British cycle supply. GREAT places to get all your parts from.
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Old 06-01-2012, 12:39 AM   #8
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

Hey Rat , nice bike, I'm in Gettysburg and am building a similar Triumph. Cafe's cycle in New Oxford can lace up wheels for you. Ron's a good guy and knows Triumphs.
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Old 06-01-2012, 08:32 AM   #9
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

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Originally Posted by Ratrodder23 View Post

Also anymore advice on lacing a wheel yourself? I've never tried, maybe Im wrong but I feel like the conical hubs would be the wrong place to start?

Thanks again
I just laced my conical hubs last week... They are really no different than other hubs, except fo the fact that there are 4 distinct spoke styles that make up one wheel, but if you think about it logically it's pretty easy:

You figure you have 2 sides to your hub, left and right. The left (brake side) is a LOT larger in diameter than the right, so off the bat you can split your spokes into 2 batches easily because the brake side spokes are distinctly shorter than the speedo-side.

From there it becomes a matter of looking at the bends. On each side of the hub, you have inner and outter spokes. The spokes for the OUTTER brake-side, have a much more dramatic bend than the INNER, because they have to wrap around the edge of the hub flange, and come back to center. The INNER side have a much more subtle bend because they can pretty much go through the flange, and fall naturally toward the center of the rim.

On the speedo-side, the spokes all go through the hub from the same direction but, if you look at hub, you'll notice that the spoke holes are staggered... The OUTTER holes hold the outter spokes, and the INNER holes hold the inner spokes. The INNER holes have a longer bore to them, because there is more meat on the hub that has to be drilled through... the OUTTER holes are shorter. Look at the spoke heads, and you'll see that one is slightly longer than the other from head to bend... Guess which ones go where.

The rim itself is directional, but it also is pretty easy to figure out with a little logic... The holes that should align with the brake side are drilled at a more acute angle than the speedo side... this is because the short spokes are on a much more acute angle to the rim, due to the large flange on the hub.

Best advice is to take a shit-ton of pictures of a stock wheel, from both sides and keep them handy. Use reference points in the pictures, like the valve stem hole on the rim and a sprocket bolt hole on the hub to match what's in front of you. Buy a spoke wrench! Don't try to use a small adjustable or small open end. Don't force or bend anything, if the pattern is right, everything should pretty much fall into place on it's own. Pick a nice, quiet time when you have a few hours to spend... get a 6 pack, maybe a bag of weed... put on some good music... take your time, and enjoy one of the most rewarding, zen-like experiences of working on your own bike!

Here's a link that might help you out a bit:
http://www.jockeyjournal.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=65054

Oh, and be prepared to pull everything apart a couple of times...

Hope that helps.
-BK
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Old 06-01-2012, 07:10 PM   #10
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

I replaced the speedo drive with a pushbike bell, looks good, ding ding!
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Old 07-03-2012, 08:28 PM   #11
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

Well I got a front wheel recently. It's an original Jones 21" wm1. I'm going to use the conical front hub. While doing some more reading on lacing wheels I read that with a conical hub the wheel needs to be drilled at a certain angle so that the spokes line up correctly. Can anyone tell me if the wheel I bought is correct for the hub or did I waste my money?

Thanks in advance




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Old 07-03-2012, 10:07 PM   #12
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

Bike looks good the way it sits, but can understand wanting to make it yours.I like the front end.I was building a similar one for my bike, but went in a different direction.Gonna have to rethink things.Have you been riding it? If so, how is the ride with just one spring?Seems to me it would be a little weak.But thats why Im asking.
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Old 07-03-2012, 10:20 PM   #13
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

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Originally Posted by Ratrodder23 View Post
Well I got a front wheel recently. It's an original Jones 21" wm1. I'm going to use the conical front hub. While doing some more reading on lacing wheels I read that with a conical hub the wheel needs to be drilled at a certain angle so that the spokes line up correctly. Can anyone tell me if the wheel I bought is correct for the hub or did I waste my money?

The rim for a conical hub is different than the rim for a spool hub.
There is a difference in nipple angle and used as is there would be a lot of bind.
You could elongate the nipple holes but I would rather look for the right rim instead of modifying that nice Jones rim.
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Old 07-03-2012, 10:56 PM   #14
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

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The rim for a conical hub is different than the rim for a spool hub.
There is a difference in nipple angle and used as is there would be a lot of bind.
You could elongate the nipple holes but I would rather look for the right rim instead of modifying that nice Jones rim.
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Also what He said
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Old 07-04-2012, 10:56 AM   #15
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

as for the wheel bearing spacer thing, just space the bearings so that the "crush tube" in the center of the hub takes all the crush load from tightening of the axle nuts, and does not allow the center of the bearing to be pushed out of the race.
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Old 07-04-2012, 02:32 PM   #16
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

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Bike looks good the way it sits, but can understand wanting to make it yours.I like the front end.I was building a similar one for my bike, but went in a different direction.Gonna have to rethink things.Have you been riding it? If so, how is the ride with just one spring?Seems to me it would be a little weak.But thats why Im asking.
I live in Amish Country PA, the roads sucks for the most part. This is the first classic bike I've ridden so I cant compare it to anything, but I think it rides okay. Its not " comfortable" but its more then bare able. I don't know what the leaf spring was from, but its pretty damn stiff actually and does seem to work pretty well.

This is a really bummer on that wheel. I was really excited when I found it. I'm having a hell of a hard time finding a dimpled 40 spoke 21" wheel, ill run either a wm1 or wm2. Lowbrow has a un-drilled Akront 21" wm1 but its flanged and I really don't like the look.

I'm about ready to say screw it and forget the front conical hub and just run a spool hub, I don't know how I feel about no front brakes though. Also will my 16" Harley drop center wheel lace up to the rear conical. I did a search on that and saw a lot of people say you shouldn't do it, but ive also seen a lot of conical hubs laced to that wheel.


Who would think you could have this much trouble getting some wheels.

Thanks for the help
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Old 07-04-2012, 03:39 PM   #17
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

Sorry Man. You'll have the same nipple angle problems on the rear. But I can tell you from experience that the conical hub front brake is not all that efficient.
On a previous project I changed out the '68-'70 tls brake with a '71 front end and conical brake to get the what I thought would be better brakes and I was really disappointed.
These conical hubs are loved by cafe racers though and you could exchange the rear for a sixties Triumph hub and brake and have money towards some stainless spokes.
The leaf spring front end is not really traditional - meaning it wasn't around on '60s and '70s custom bikes - and therefore would look O.K. with a disc brake on the left.
You could use the Jones rim on a disc hub.
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Old 07-04-2012, 04:32 PM   #18
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

Take a look at the triumph pic thread.Lots of guys doing it.Had my conical laced to a 16" drop center untill I went to a 19" rim.If you decide to go that route, I have a set of spokes real cheap if you're interested.
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Old 07-04-2012, 05:57 PM   #19
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

Central Wheel in England has several different brands of 40 spoke WM1-21" rims:

http://www.central-wheel.co.uk/rims/rims.html

There are 2 different versions of the conical rear hub, can you post a photo of the drive side of yours?

Eric
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Old 07-04-2012, 09:44 PM   #20
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Default Re: Getting ready for my first Triumph build, a few questions

Ive seen all the pictures of the conical hubs laced to the 16in drop center wheel, so I assume although its not perfect, it is something that you can do?

As far as the rear hubs, I have two. The top one has a really smooth finish on it, while the bottom one has a textured finish to it. I also see they have the different bearing retainers. Im considering using the top one, but I would need to get the drum lining replaced as its totally shot. I was thinking I would send it to Vintage Brake along with the front hub to get both of them worked over.

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